Morning oppo, have you driven a 4 speed lately?

"Highlander-Datsuns are Forever" (jamesbowland) 07/31/2019 at 10:53 • Filed to: Datsun 240Z

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First is about the same as my Mazda, second is a bit taller, third is like fourth and fourth is between 4th and fifth in the Mazda. Third is very tall like 6,500 rpm is 80 mph in third. Not much on the AM these days either.

Dr. Zoidberg - RIP Oppo > Highlander-Datsuns are Forever 07/31/2019 at 11:04

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Somehow I’ve never owned a 4-speed manual . My Legacy, Civic, Celica, two pickups, three Tercels, all had 5-speeds.

MonkeePuzzle > Highlander-Datsuns are Forever 07/31/2019 at 11:07

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if you include reverse, I daily a 4 speed.

TheTurbochargedSquirrel > Highlander-Datsuns are Forever 07/31/2019 at 11:08

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The Mini is about a 4.5 speed and I drove it to work this morning. Does that count?

Full of the sound of the Gran Fury, signifying nothing. > Highlander-Datsuns are Forever 07/31/2019 at 11:09

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The last 4-speed I drove was my Dasher wagon back in 1984. Unless you count the Windscar, but I don’t since that was autotragic (and a waste of steel).

benjrblant > MonkeePuzzle 07/31/2019 at 11:10

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Don't forget neutral. Zero is a speed too.

Highlander-Datsuns are Forever > Dr. Zoidberg - RIP Oppo 07/31/2019 at 11:12

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A ll of my datsuns have been 4 speeds, my first 240z , the B210 and the 510 wagon were 4 speeds. My step dads 310GX was a dog leg 5 speed. I guess people didn’t care about going super fast in the 70's. 

Pickup_man > Highlander-Datsuns are Forever 07/31/2019 at 11:13

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It’s been a while since I’ve had this bad boy out, so no, I haven’t. 

Highlander-Datsuns are Forever > Full of the sound of the Gran Fury, signifying nothing. 07/31/2019 at 11:14

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I wasn’t driving yet in ‘84. 

Highlander-Datsuns are Forever > TheTurbochargedSquirrel 07/31/2019 at 11:15

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How do you get 4.5 speed, is one gar 1/2 way gone to shit?

Highlander-Datsuns are Forever > MonkeePuzzle 07/31/2019 at 11:15

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Automatics need not apply. 

Highlander-Datsuns are Forever > Pickup_man 07/31/2019 at 11:15

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Still newer than my datsun. 

MonkeePuzzle > benjrblant 07/31/2019 at 11:16

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and in my commute zero is such a frequent speed I shouldnt have discounted it

AestheticsInMotion > Highlander-Datsuns are Forever 07/31/2019 at 11:18

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I think my old Datsun pickup was a 4 speed.

Wait, does a 5 speed with no second gear count? 

CaptDale - is secretly British > Highlander-Datsuns are Forever 07/31/2019 at 11:21

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Not in a very long time

Highlander-Datsuns are Forever > AestheticsInMotion 07/31/2019 at 11:25

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1. cool

2. kinda not really

Highlander-Datsuns are Forever > CaptDale - is secretly British 07/31/2019 at 11:26

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If triumph and MG were still making sports cars they would be 4 speed manuals. 

MonkeePuzzle > TheTurbochargedSquirrel 07/31/2019 at 11:30

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oh I’ve had that before

CaptDale - is secretly British > Highlander-Datsuns are Forever 07/31/2019 at 11:34

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I bet they would have gone to 5. I think my Healey is a 4 speed still. Though I can’t remember if the PO did the 5 speed swap or not. I guess I will find out when I finally put it all back together. 

wafflesnfalafel > Highlander-Datsuns are Forever 07/31/2019 at 11:41

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the last 4spd manual I drove was a cr@ppy little 1984 Honda Civic base - 4spds and about twelve horsepower, (but it would routinely get 40mpg mixed....)

ITA97, now with more Jag @ opposite-lock.com > Highlander-Datsuns are Forever 07/31/2019 at 11:43

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Probably the last 4-speed manual I’ve driven was an early 240z, albeit a racecar and that was probably 10 years ago. My parent’s (formerly mine) GMT400 E scalade does have a 4-speed auto.

TheTurbochargedSquirrel > Highlander-Datsuns are Forever 07/31/2019 at 11:51

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Yup. You can’t always get it to go into 2nd. 

Highlander-Datsuns are Forever > ITA97, now with more Jag @ opposite-lock.com 07/31/2019 at 11:51

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My dads race car 240z has a close ratio 5 speed, the stock 4 is okay but there is such a jump from 2nd to third it doesn’t lend it’s self to racing as well .

Highlander-Datsuns are Forever > wafflesnfalafel 07/31/2019 at 11:52

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Cool, my B210 was the same, nearly 4o mpg but a factory rated 75 HP at 5100 rpm. OHV engine too. 

Highlander-Datsuns are Forever > CaptDale - is secretly British 07/31/2019 at 11:54

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I like cars with power, 10/10 love the C4! LT1 is a hell of an engine .

CaptDale - is secretly British > Highlander-Datsuns are Forever 07/31/2019 at 11:55

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Yeah the C4 is ticking some good boxes for me. It is fun, but needs some massaging. 

ITA97, now with more Jag @ opposite-lock.com > Highlander-Datsuns are Forever 07/31/2019 at 12:08

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This car is an SCCA ITS car, of which the rules would prevent the 5 speed swap. That car was also the first real racecar I ever drove (and the first car in which I had an off course excursion). I got to do laps around the then brand new local track in that 240z when I was 14, before I had a driver’s license .

That car is one of my favorite cars to play with for a session on track. Something about the nature of that car is just a bit on the wild side, and it has a way of beating you up just a bit. It goes around a track at roughly the same pace as my racecar or a spec miata, but unlike those car’s this one doesn’t leave you jumping out at the end of a 45 minute session and wildly anticipating the next session. You come into impound at the end of the session, loosen the belts, remove your helmet and neck restraint, remove the steering wheel, and then sit there for a few minute or two resting before wanting to climb out .

benn454 > Highlander-Datsuns are Forever 07/31/2019 at 12:32

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I sold my 1987 S-10 with an Iron Duke and 4 speed to my uncle as a manual transmission training device for my cousin about 6 months ago.

It was my beater commuter for about 2 years before that. It was slow as crap, but being RWD and super light, was still fun. Got better mileage than I had expected, as well. I did wish for another gear on the interstate though, 3000 RPM at 70 MPH was a bit loud.

Highlander-Datsuns are Forever > benn454 07/31/2019 at 12:38

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The datsun is 3,000 rpm at 60, the engine is however designed to rotate at higher RPMs than most so it’s just starting to sing at 3,000 rpm and will cruise at 4,000 rpm all day long without issue. 

fintail > Highlander-Datsuns are Forever 07/31/2019 at 12:40

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Fintail is a 4-speed, I drove it Sunday. 4 speed automatic though, but without a torque converter, so that has to be worth something :)

A 4 on the tree was standard, I’d rather not.  

Highlander-Datsuns are Forever > ITA97, now with more Jag @ opposite-lock.com 07/31/2019 at 12:42

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Not having power steering doesn’t help. The seat is also so far back that you really feel the G’s in the corners. I also find the Z at the limit is incredibly fast but also super twitchy , putting a real race set up suspension under the car helps a ton but it doesn’t change the 60/40 weight ratio at all, and that rear end will kick out and kick your ass at the most unexpected times.

Highlander-Datsuns are Forever > fintail 07/31/2019 at 12:43

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How does a car have an automatic without a torque converter? That is some wizardry or something.

Tripper > Highlander-Datsuns are Forever 07/31/2019 at 12:46

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Almost every day. Luckily I’m only on the highway for 4 miles. 7 0mph+ with that engine/exhaust setup is tough on the ears when you’re cruising.

Cé hé sin > Highlander-Datsuns are Forever 07/31/2019 at 12:50

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Fluid coupling instead. GM did them too.

Mer cedes offer the MCT gearbox nowadays which doesn’t have any kind of fluid linkage, it’s all done with clutches.

fintail > Highlander-Datsuns are Forever 07/31/2019 at 12:50

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It’s similar in theory to an old GM Hydramatic, I think. Some explanation here:

https://www.sl113.org/wiki/Automatic/Start

https://www.wikiwand.com/en/Mercedes-Benz_first_series_automatic_transmission

Cé hé sin > Highlander-Datsuns are Forever 07/31/2019 at 12:51

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With overdrives!

Highlander-Datsuns are Forever > Tripper 07/31/2019 at 12:52

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You have the 70's bmw yes? That car is very cool, and yeah, if I had to drive the Datsun windows down for more than 10 minutes I’d be deaf in my left ear .

benn454 > Highlander-Datsuns are Forever 07/31/2019 at 12:57

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 The Duke is much happier puttering around town at around 1500-2500. 4000 is just about the end of the world. I don't recall ever revving it higher, on account of age and Iron Dukes having issues when revved that high.

Tripper > Highlander-Datsuns are Forever 07/31/2019 at 13:08

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Yes, and thanks. I love it when I’m going through the gears or ripping through a tunnel, but the drone at 4k+ just sitting there is rough.

I’m on the fence about a 5 speed swap. It’s g reat for long trips , but we took it to a wedding weekend (3hrs round trip) and it was great! I mean we couldn’t really talk or anything and there’s no radio or A/C, but t he weather was perfect! W hich, as you know makes driving an old car 8 million times better.

Also, at this point the car is setup “just so”. I’ve had the carbs balanced and the timing set perfectly to match the cam . I’ve spent a lot of time with one of my nerd buddies perfecting the suspension settings with this crazy wire setup thing he has. I’m afraid a 5 speed will fuck it all up, haha.

ITA97, now with more Jag @ opposite-lock.com > Highlander-Datsuns are Forever 07/31/2019 at 13:10

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Nothing out there on the racetrack has power steering (except for some of the T1 guys in Z06 vettes or vipers). The car’s owner has run a rental racecar business, along with a long history of open wheel racing. We’ve never figured out exactly why his Z feels like it kicks your ass (and he has owned it and raced it since the 70's), but it leaves you more tired than driving a session in a Formula Ford while going tremendously slower around the track and pulling a fraction of the G’s in a corner. The rear end on these cars is certainly lively when driven well, but it never once surprised me.

It must have something to do with the mental energy drain of the car always feeling like you’re dancing with the devil out on the limit.  Of course, that’s also what makes that car so much damned fun.

McMike > Highlander-Datsuns are Forever 07/31/2019 at 13:16

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All I have are four speeds.  Only on the vans is 4th an overdrive.   The British stuff is a straight 1:1.

MiniGTI - now with XJ6 > Highlander-Datsuns are Forever 07/31/2019 at 13:24

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This is 4 on the floor with ( long since dead) electric overdrive that raises the final drive in 3rd and 4th gears. No British electric jokes, the solenoid works; the engagement clutch must be jammed or something.

RPM is a bit high on the expressway but at 70+ mph the wind drowns out the engine screaming 3500. If the overdrive worked probably would improve the awful MPH though. 

Highlander-Datsuns are Forever > MiniGTI - now with XJ6 07/31/2019 at 13:31

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One of my local friends has a TR6 and a tree just fell on it.... sad day. Gotta get that over drive working again. I don’t really notice the engine screaming as much as the wind noise and some tires that are slightly out of balance . When you get to 80 the wind starts sucking the window frame s out of the car.

My bird IS the word > Highlander-Datsuns are Forever 07/31/2019 at 14:13

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Compare that to how ridiculously short my 6 speed is geared

HFV has no HFV. But somehow has 2 motorcycles > Highlander-Datsuns are Forever 07/31/2019 at 14:16

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Last one I drove was a 76 Land Cruiser. 

Highlander-Datsuns are Forever > My bird IS the word 07/31/2019 at 14:18

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You have to like to shift a lot in a modern 6 speed. 

My bird IS the word > Highlander-Datsuns are Forever 07/31/2019 at 15:05

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I just skip gears. Im sure its done for epa fuel economy but I wish it just had a super tall OD 6 and acted like a 5 speed like the mustang

Highlander-Datsuns are Forever > My bird IS the word 07/31/2019 at 15:13

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6th in my outback is 3,000 rpm at 80 mph, I frequently skip 2nd gear and 3rd depending. The problem with the outback is it has so little power 6 won’t pull unless you have a tail wind. 

CB > Highlander-Datsuns are Forever 07/31/2019 at 17:16

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I don’t drive a four speed, but my work truck is locked on an AM station because there’s nothing else out here.

MM54 > Highlander-Datsuns are Forever 07/31/2019 at 17:39

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Not in 13-14 months (which is how long it’s been since the Chevelle was drivable). Hopefully again soon, though.

Highlander-Datsuns are Forever > CB 07/31/2019 at 17:42

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Even if my radio worked I don’t know if I could hear it over the wind and engine noise. 

Future Heap Owner > Highlander-Datsuns are Forever 07/31/2019 at 18:31

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Never